tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post1292731604882683080..comments2024-03-26T12:19:52.801-04:00Comments on Tea at Trianon: The Legend of Pope Joan, Part 1elena maria vidalhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17129629173535139807noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-791830883417111352010-07-06T11:45:50.267-04:002010-07-06T11:45:50.267-04:00It really annoys me when people accept such pap. I...It really annoys me when people accept such pap. I mean, really... The poor church can't win. I must admit to an enjoyment of all of the rabbit trails and tails of history, but the training in history and theology leads one to recognize such for just that: interesting or diverting stories. Even before I did my degrees, I could, generally, sift fact from fiction in such things--or knew enough to take it to someone who would know. So, I don't quite understand why people are so quick to accept quackery. (?) Then again, Paul said something about "ears being tickled," if memory serves. Thanks so much for the informative post. It's been awhile since I've read much on the subject.Aronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02997427811519149154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-42229011755788195022009-02-27T22:38:00.000-05:002009-02-27T22:38:00.000-05:00There is indeed, noe room for doubt. Thank you fo...There is indeed, noe room for doubt. Thank you for such a clear and indisputable response.Lucy https://www.blogger.com/profile/13600064401395449845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-18336894569408752102009-02-27T20:42:00.000-05:002009-02-27T20:42:00.000-05:00Yes, dear Lucy, I understand. I, too, have great d...Yes, dear Lucy, I understand. I, too, have great devotion to St. Joan of Arc who, like the legendary "Pope Joan" has also been distorted and used by feminists for their agenda. Unlike "Pope Joan," who we are not certain even existed at all, St. Joan is probably one of the most well-documented medieval women. The evidence gathered about her at both her initial examination after her arrival at the Dauphin's court combined with the volumes of testimony compiled at her trial for witchcraft give as a very definite sense of her personality. Also the retrial and the evidence gathered for her Cause for sainthood~ we know about her early piety and consecration to God, her closeness to her mother and her love of embroidery, her choice of consecrated virginity, her extraordinary miracles, attested to by many miracles. There is no room for doubt about the heroism and sanctity of the great saint.elena maria vidalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17129629173535139807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-73864060603466799902009-02-27T20:17:00.000-05:002009-02-27T20:17:00.000-05:00Growing up I was taught about Joan of Arc by my mo...Growing up I was taught about Joan of Arc by my mom, grandmother,and of course during sunday school. I loved learning about her. Later, during highschool and college, Popess Joan was all the rage- like you, I was surrounded by weomen's groups using her as their mentor for causes that I know would have been contrary to any of her thoughts. the bashing of the Catholic Church was an ongoing feat with these groups..so, of course, as I was asserting my own won=manhood I felt very uneasy with the whole distortian of the Joan I knew and what she was now meant to reoresent. Am I clear?(feels like I'm rambling)Lucy https://www.blogger.com/profile/13600064401395449845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-45520058184554621612009-02-27T19:41:00.000-05:002009-02-27T19:41:00.000-05:00Thanks, everybody. Stay tuned....Lucy, I was just ...Thanks, everybody. Stay tuned....<BR/><BR/>Lucy, I was just wondering, what were taught you taught about Pope Joan?elena maria vidalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17129629173535139807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-27898652262015183162009-02-27T16:01:00.000-05:002009-02-27T16:01:00.000-05:00I grew up having such mixed feelings about the tal...I grew up having such mixed feelings about the tales and what I personally was taught about her. Exceptional people are always confronted with mixed stories leaving them so open for others to manipulate for their own gain. Joan's story reflects this in many ways. Fascinating article, thank you so much.Lucy https://www.blogger.com/profile/13600064401395449845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-42639578618490809902009-02-27T11:29:00.000-05:002009-02-27T11:29:00.000-05:00What a fascinating article! Thanks for all your ha...What a fascinating article! Thanks for all your hard work contributing to a more accurate understanding of the past, it really is very important.Mayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18230268418171628594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-27866934551813285212009-02-27T11:28:00.000-05:002009-02-27T11:28:00.000-05:00Oh no! ... a movie? Well if Boobus Americanus ca...Oh no! ... a movie? Well if Boobus Americanus can buy into 'DaVinciCode/AmericanTreasure/Holyblood/grail' type bulloney, I'm sure they'll scoop it right up. I thought the movie had already been done years ago. I seem to remember a pic of Mia Farrow in papal drag.<BR/><BR/> re feminism: There's a lot of truth to that radical feminist's quote about womens' sexual liberation---it simply put a lot of hookers out of business. And abortion shouldn't be just a womens' issue. Nowadays, with DNA testing, dudes (and dudes just wanna have fun) can get clobbered with child support! So guys - lets get behind the pro"choice" movement and help keep the abortuaries open. Lets party til we're on Social Security!!! (er,...eh,..what social security?)<BR/><BR/> Very interesting - in India, abortion has backfired as a feminist issue - only baby girls were being killed.tubbshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07272003035464034763noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-43443432282284084032009-02-27T09:56:00.000-05:002009-02-27T09:56:00.000-05:00I think that the story was probably based on an ac...I think that the story was probably based on an actual person or combination of persons. It was an immensely popular story in the Middle Ages and came to be represented in art and architecture. The main thing is that the chronology of the incident does not fit with recorded history, not even with contemporary documents of papal enemies. To me, the historical reality of how Marozia and the Theophylacts dominated the papacy is much more scandalous and damaging to the Church than the legend of some poor woman scholar masquerading as a man. Whether a woman was ever accidentally elected Pope is one thing; how the legend has been used over the years, by both friends and foes of the Church, is another.<BR/><BR/>I wonder why someone hasn't done a movie about Marozia.....elena maria vidalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17129629173535139807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7534539169157708222.post-13293051243126320862009-02-27T09:40:00.000-05:002009-02-27T09:40:00.000-05:00This is so interesting!I first read about Pope Joa...This is so interesting!<BR/>I first read about Pope Joan, when reading Donna Woolfolk Cross' book with the same title. In the epilog I think it says that the story of Pope Joan is (or at least, might be) fictional. So then I thought that it was a fictional story. But some years later I looked in a lexicon from the 20's, and there it said that Pope Joan was a woman pope in the 9th century. This left me a bit uncertain, but I thought, that since the book was from the 20's, it's maybe not thoroughly researched. Later on I read about her in a book about forgotten women in history, and there it said again, that she might have been a real person, since there was about 500 old texts mentioning her, even authors as Petrarca and Boccaccio. And then they also described that odd ceremony with the bathing/birthing chair, that you mentioned. So after that, I was almost convinced that she has existed.<BR/>But now I'm uncertain again! :DNinonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06990998892964365748noreply@blogger.com